Developer meeting January 2014: Difference between revisions
(→Agenda) |
David Mudrak (talk | contribs) m (Text replacement - "class="nicetable"" to "class="wikitable"") |
||
(18 intermediate revisions by 8 users not shown) | |||
Line 1: | Line 1: | ||
[[Developer meetings]] > January 2014 meeting notes | [[Developer meetings]] > January 2014 meeting notes | ||
{| class=" | {| class="wikitable" | ||
|- | |- | ||
| Time | | Time | ||
Line 16: | Line 16: | ||
|} | |} | ||
The meeting was streamed live on YouTube with chat through the regular Dev chat room and comments on Twitter. | |||
== Meeting Video == | |||
<mediaplayer>http://youtu.be/o5G0nPzGpZI</mediaplayer> | |||
''Note: For an optimised view and to see the chat log, change settings to 1024p HD quality.'' | |||
== Meeting Notes == | |||
=== Possible future changes to Conditional Activities (Sam Marshall, OU) === | |||
* More flexible, plug-able conditions | |||
* Better access through groupings | |||
* Better interface, lean and mean | |||
* No docs yet, spec and issues coming | |||
* | === Quiz editing changes (Tim Hunt, Colin Chamber, Mahmoud Kassaei, OU) === | ||
* | * [https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40987 Issue], [https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=231180 Discussion] | ||
* | * Dependency between questions as a user works through a quiz | ||
* Improving the interface to make it simpler, similar to course page editing, which people are familiar with. | |||
* Possibly a new "combinable" question type that allows something similar to cloze, but with a simpler interface. | |||
* Possibly other OU question types coming to core. It would be good if the community could provide feedback on what's in the Plugins Directory currently. | |||
If you have something you'd like to add to the | === Moodle 2.7 progress === | ||
==== Prototypes site (Martin Dougiamas) ==== | |||
* [http://prototype.moodle.net prototype.moodle.net] | |||
* A site for early development to gather feedback | |||
* Projects currently there include navigation, editor replacement, forum changes, outcomes... | |||
==== Clean as default theme (Jérôme Mouneyrac) ==== | |||
* [https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1eea9oQj1bihpWpsYJGstX_CASLBFF7N51M6DLquixK0/edit?pli=1#slide=id.g2a33bfb2a_097 Notes] | |||
* Resolve open bugs | |||
* Default theme on new install | |||
* Increase configurability, requires ability to compile LESS on-the-fly. | |||
* New navigation is being considered | |||
* Adding an element library | |||
* Allow people to add bootswatches | |||
* It intended that we will move most themes to Plugins Directory (not Standard, Clean or base themes) | |||
* Bootstrap 3 has been considered and won't be adopted yet | |||
==== Editor replacement (Damyon Wiese) ==== | |||
* [https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Editor_2.7 Docs] | |||
* TinyMCE3 is out of support | |||
* Editor is critical part of Moodle and has huge impact on user experience | |||
* Editor search narrowed down to TinyMCE4, CKEditor and Atto. | |||
* Prototypes were put up and feedback requested. | |||
* Tending towards Atto, with a CKEditor in the Plugins Directory for those who want it. | |||
==== Old Assignment removal (Damyon Wiese) ==== | |||
* [https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-33952 Issue] | |||
* The old assignment has been removed and on upgrade instances of the old assignment will be converted to the new. | |||
* If you are using an old assignment type that is not represented in the new assignment you will have to install the old assignment module from the Plugins Directory | |||
==== Outcomes (Andrew Davis) ==== | |||
* [https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40230 Issue], [https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Outcomes_Specification Docs] | |||
* A lot of work done on Outcomes before 2.6 that didn't make it into the release. | |||
* We're reviewing Totara and Elis to see what features are needed overall. | |||
==== New logging (Rajesh Taneja) ==== | |||
* New events system is in place | |||
* Old logging calls are being converted to events | |||
* More information captured than previous logging | |||
* Performance is an issue, with more events being captured | |||
** Initiatives to optimise DB queries with a single batch insert at the end of a page load. | |||
* Ability to create new observers to reduce the reliance on the log table for real-time analytics | |||
* Logging system is more plugable. | |||
** Potential to push logs to external database | |||
=== Moodle Mobile update (Juan Leyva) === | |||
* New version of app coming soon (fixing issues with new devices with Android 4.4 and old devices with Android 2.1 and 2.3) | |||
* Potential to use the app from the desktop (See https://docs.moodle.org/26/en/Running_Moodle_Mobile_in_Desktop) | |||
* PUSH notifications is top priority | |||
=== Integration update (Dan Poltawski) === | |||
* Pre-checking of issues by CiBot (Continuous integration bot) automated checks on changes before they are submitted to integration (waiting for integration, peer review or with label "cime") ([https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2662 Issue]) | |||
* Testing requirements | |||
** PHPUnit or Behat tests required for changes | |||
* Behat improvements | |||
** Working on Linux and Windows. Firefox is the preferred browser. Chrome is being improved. IE is somewhat working and Safari... ([https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Acceptance_testing/Browsers Docs]) | |||
** You can get automatic screenshots when a test fails ($CFG->behat_screenshots_path: [http://git.moodle.org/gw?p=moodle.git;a=blob;f=config-dist.php#l659 link]) | |||
** Parallel Behat testing ([https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-39752 issue]) | |||
* Misc | |||
** Specific rules for [https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Backporting backporting] | |||
** Please be aware of the [https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Schedule weekly integration schedule] | |||
=== Long term support (Martin Dougiamas) === | |||
* 2.7 is going to be a long-term release that will be supported for longer (3 years instead of 18months) | |||
* Backports will be required to backport bug-fixes to the LTS release | |||
=== A better video conferencing solution for Gen Dev meetings? (Michael de Raadt) === | |||
* GoToMeeting (no free) | |||
* Need more suggestions | |||
=== Questions === | |||
Q. What are the plans in 2.7 for Gradebook improvements?<br /> | |||
A. Minor bugs being fixed. Three major projects happening, but not going into 2.7. (See MDL-25423) | |||
Q. Will the base theme no longer receive updates or be actively worked on?<br /> | |||
A. It will be kept for long term support and fixed for bugs, but may go away after a number of versions. | |||
Q. Anymore changes to the event system? We want to start planning/scoping out analytics/alerts using the new event system in 2.6, but don't want to progress if more changes are expected.<br /> | |||
A. Mostly stable now. | |||
Q. Global Search?<br /> | |||
A. Code has been written. Waiting for code review for core. | |||
Q. Any plans to actually treat the code freeze deadline as a code freeze for 2.7?<br /> | |||
A. That freeze should be colder than last time. | |||
== Live Attendees == | |||
Adam Olley, Adrian Greeve, Amy Groshek, Andrew Davis, Andrew Nicols, Ankit Agarwal, Anthony Borrow, Aparup Banerjee, Barbara Ramiro, Bas Brands, Damyon Wiese, Dan Bennett, Dan Poltawski, David Monllaó, David Mudrák, Davo Smith, Eloy Lafuente, Eric Merrill, Frédéric Massart, Helen Foster, Jason Fowler, Jason Hardin, Jenny Gray, Juan Leyva, Justin Filip, Jérôme Mouneyrac, Kirsty, Marina Glancy, Mark Johnson, Martin Dougiamas, Martín Langhoff, Mary Cooch, Matthew Spurrier, Michael de Raadt, Mike Churchward, Moodle Bot, Prateek Sachan, Rajesh Taneja, Rex Lorenzo, Rossiani Wijaya, Ruslan Kabalin, S Bourget, Sam Hemelryk, Sam Marshall, Tim Hunt, Tomasz Muras, XY Ng | |||
== Meeting chat log == | |||
<div style="height:300px;overflow:auto;"> | |||
{| class="wikitable" | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| 123 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:02:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| ping | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:02:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| testing | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:02:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Hi, all. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:02:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| Good morning | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:02:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| commiserations sam | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| what is it there sam h? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Mudrák</span> | |||
| hello | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| 2am now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Barbara Ramiro</span> | |||
| Hi | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| awesome. going out raving after the meeting? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Did someone say rave? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| techno techno techno techno]# | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| unce unce unce | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:03:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| If someone is using a screen reader here they're probably getting excited! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| brrrrr wubwubwub do doo doo brrwub | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ruslan Kabalin</span> | |||
| Hello | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| Hi | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sbourget</span> | |||
| Hello | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| hey, by end of the meeting you can play the 'it's 4 o'clock in the morning and it's starting to get light' happy hardcore song, I love that one. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:04:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Yes! :D | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:05:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| is the link to youtubepasted here? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:06:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:06:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Now it is | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:06:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| I can get chat on my iPad burr some reason Adium is borked | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:06:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| It's live | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:07:01 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| You're on! *waves* | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:07:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mary Cooch</span> | |||
| we can see you | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:07:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Mudrák</span> | |||
| Moodle Meetings: you're on my radar | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:07:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Sam just said responded to bug reports | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:08:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Time the lag | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:08:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:09:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:09:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mary Cooch</span> | |||
| oh wow | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:10:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mary Cooch</span> | |||
| "or"/not | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:10:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (do we do introductions/his?) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:11:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Tim you can be next if you want | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:11:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I need to open some browser tabs | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:11:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| sorry Im late | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:12:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| pidgin doesn't like my laptop | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:12:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| loving it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:12:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| I don't know where to comment about this.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:13:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| but we've got a few things which want pluggable versions of the same thigns now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:13:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| like badges | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:13:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| Is there a tracker ticket for these changes? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:13:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| although now i'm thinking, does badges allow activity level awards | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:13:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| OK, I think I am ready. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:14:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Good [insert appropriate time of day / night here] everyone. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:16:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I thought badges used conditional activities | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:17:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Yes, performance will be tough | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:17:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Mudrák</span> | |||
| Dan P: +1 for trying not to do same things in paralel | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jenny Gray</span> | |||
| I can imagine some open courseware sites that would love conditional courses with the same sorts of rules too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Hi from Tim at the OU in Milton Keynes. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Hi, Dan from Moodle HQ, Perth Australia | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| Hi, my name is David | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Davo Smith</span> | |||
| Hi, Davo, Synergy Learning (but based in Sheffield) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:18:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">bmbrands</span> | |||
| Hi from the Netherlands! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jenny Gray</span> | |||
| Hi, from Jenny at the OU in Milton Keynes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| Hello | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| Hi, Tomek Muras here | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Anthony Borrow</span> | |||
| Hi from Albuquerque | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| Hi from Belgium | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Hi, Adrian from Moodle HQ, Perth | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Hello! Dan from HowToMoodle (UK) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| Hi, Sam Hemelryk from Nelson, New Zealand | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| Jason from HQ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| sam at the Open University in Milton Keynes, UK (as hopefully you noticed from logo on all my slides | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| Hi, Adam from NetSpot | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| Hi, Jerome from Moodle HQ, Perth | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">kirsty</span> | |||
| Hi from Kirsty at HowToMoodle | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Amy Groshek | |||
| Hi from Amy Groshek, Minnesota, US</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Barbara Ramiro</span> | |||
| Hi from HQ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| Hello, Rex from Los Angeles, CA, USA | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:32 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| hi from HQ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| Hi, Aparup Banerjee, moodle HQ perth</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mary Cooch</span> | |||
| Hi from Moodle HQ outpost in Preston Lancs | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Mudrák</span> | |||
| Hi, David Mudrak, Czech | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sbourget</span> | |||
| Hi, Steve from New Hampshire USA | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Prateek Sachan</span> | |||
| Hi, Prateek Sachan here. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:19:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Helen Foster</span> | |||
| hi, Helen in Belgium | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:20:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| lol, I liked the 'what the hell are we doing' there | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:21:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Haha | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:21:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Hi, everyone. Thanks for coming. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:21:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Martin Dougiamas waves from home in Perth | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:21:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jenny Gray</span> | |||
| wow, sam my time lag is even longer than yours! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:21:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| so can you define dependency between questions on the question level (so in question bank and not just in the quiz) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:23:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40987 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:24:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=231180 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:24:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| error at moodlehq | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:25:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| restarting | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:25:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| back now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:26:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| you look to be back Moodle Meetings | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:26:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| I just heard Michael ask everyone to say hi and where they are from. Wow... the lag is going to make asking questions here really difficult. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:26:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| snap | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:26:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://github.com/moodleou/moodle-qtype_combined | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:27:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| jfilip: can you think of your questions in advance? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:27:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mary Cooch</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:27:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| I just reloaded the G+ event page so hopefully it's less lagged now? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:28:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| We're looking at tims Github screen if that helps jfilip | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:29:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| http://www.open.edu/openlearnworks/course/view.php?id=1643 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:29:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Thanks, it looks like you can scroll ahead in the timeline on the YouTube player so I think I'm up much closer to "live". | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:30:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| If you click the text saying "live" it should forward you right to it as well. (red dot for watching live, grey for behind) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:30:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Yes, it's got the red dot showing "Live" since I scrolled ahead. Perfect. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:31:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Drag and drop is tough on screen readers | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:32:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| +1 on the DnD questions. We love them here. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:32:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| There are aria guideline for drag and drop. They are complex though | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:33:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| We could gather some numbers on usage of qtypes on our customer's sites for contrib types. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:33:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| lesson: with a decent ui.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:33:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Using_the_question_engine_from_module | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:34:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| can we force the camera on martin? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:36:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| michael, mute microphone please? it keeps switching to you | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:36:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| thanks | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:37:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| I muted him | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:37:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| we have | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:37:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| we don't see your screen martin | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:38:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| I do | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:38:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| i do</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:38:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| fyi, to stop the screen jumping around you can click on whoever you want it to stay on. click their thumbnail at the bottom of the hangout. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:39:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| HQ I hope you are remembering to direct the camera for the recording | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:39:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| Whers the beers HQ? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:39:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| omg no beers</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:40:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| (it's super hot here, I could really use one) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:40:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| that's a lot of crazy people at HQ ... you know you have to travel home after this ... unless the tenants upstairs can be bribed ... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:40:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| TimH just popped on screen for me (again)</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:41:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43784 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:41:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1eea9oQj1bihpWpsYJGstX_CASLBFF7N51M6DLquixK0/edit?pli=1#slide=id.g2a33bfb2a_097 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:41:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| I have beer. White rabbit. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:41:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Mike Churchward | |||
| Martin -21C here. (opposite of super hot)</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:42:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| i've got a flask.. of hot water and mint tea.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:42:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| yay automatic less compiler in core!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:43:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">XY Ng</span> | |||
| martin: yep we are directing the camera | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:43:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Please stop talking about the element library, and get the code in core!!! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:43:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:43:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| (We need elements first ;)) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:43:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| No, release early and release often. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| MDL-36558 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-36558 - Add element library to moodle.V: 11, W: 22, Type: Improvement, Assignee: Sam Hemelryk, Priority: Critical, Status: Development in progress | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Get the basic strucutre, there, then people can add to it. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| Not sure if it was mentioned, but does the LESS compiler mean we'll get rid of compiled LESS css files from being tracked at all? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">bmbrands</span> | |||
| jay for bootswatches! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:44:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| +1 release early n often n om</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:45:01 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Yes it would, they would go in moodledata | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:45:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| Awesome | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:45:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Ooo i likey | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:45:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:45:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| compiled less is a pain when cherry picking :P | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:46:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| ^ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:46:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">bmbrands</span> | |||
| does it do less compiling when setting the bootswatch? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:46:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| No, this is just a POC | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:46:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| But it could (should?) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:46:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| custom css styles go in moodledata too then i guess?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:47:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| I think they already do | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:47:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| the do indeed | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:47:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| custom css styles should go into the themes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:47:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| *they | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:47:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| </span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| ah! here at last! took some work to get empathy working here</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| hey hi | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Welcome. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| I have been enjoying the show over breakfast</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| try and look at the agenda and ask your questions 2min in advance | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| POC = Point Of Care? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:48:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| Proof of concept | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:49:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| (isn't that right? lol) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:49:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| y | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:49:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Not Piece Of Cake? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:49:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| The cake is a lie adrian. A lie!!!!!! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:49:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Nano, Pico, Atto | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:51:32 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Are we really, really, sure we want to maintain our own editor? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:51:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| +1 about text editor being important. I'd be interested in how well it works in narrow width, that's a problem with current.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:51:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| tim that is the question that is not decided | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:52:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| but i have to say I'm tending that way after lots of thinking | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:52:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| the greatest benefit of maintaining our own editor is that we never have to worry about upstream changes, abandonment, and the featureset is always what we want. The worst part of that is that we would have to do the work ourselves | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:54:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| and there is no community around the editor already | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:54:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (I am suspicious about all the maths comments.. I know its important, but I also know the maths editor community are very vocal.. have to balance that to average moodle user who doesn't know what moodle.org is) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:54:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| ^ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Amy Groshek | |||
| Which of these editors have the options configurable, and how accessible is the config? Currently we are trying to alter the options for the editor in the db with an install script. Giving people options is nice, but then they complain when their theme doesn't apply to the text they've borked in the text editor…</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| maths is pretty much the same for all editors in that we need to do some custom work for all | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| we asked the survey takers to test the maths editor ... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| there was a license issue with dragmath as well | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| The other thing you need to consider with the editor | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:55:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| is the 3rd party plugins that use it currently | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Dragmath and things like voice / audio recording in the editor are very popular 3rd party plugins for our customers. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| and all of the support you will need to have for them | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| amygroshek: they all have cionfigurable options | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| drag math also works not at all on mobile | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| there are several 3rd party math plugins | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| atto is the easiest to configure already | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| and I think TinyMCE 4 is the next easiest | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| All 3rd party plugins would need to be re-written regardless. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| followed very very closely by CKEditor | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| sort of | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:52 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| some editors will already have plugins for them | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:56:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| benefit of a standard os editor | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| CK has lots, that's the main advantage of it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| my plugin should work for Tinymce in all innstances of it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| atto i have to make a plugin specifically to moodle | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Atto will cost us a lot more | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| Jason Hardin: some will have plugins that can be modified to work, yes, but not all of them can be taken and made to work with Moodle without considerable effort | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:57:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| We have a few editor plugins at the OU (biggest is our maths one). Also need to turn off standard things that don't work well for us... *shrugs* | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:58:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Amy Groshek | |||
| Use Atto. It has less options. = less theme support problems for amy.</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:58:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| Atto is close to what would work on mobile (limited set of options, neat interface) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:58:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| I'm not that bothered about updating the plugins if we don't have to do it instantly though, it says on that wiki page it'll keep old tinymce for a few versions | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:58:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| There were two questions that went along with Jerome's agenda item which I don't believe were addressed, are those going to come up later? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:58:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Just one thing about simple editor - I 100% agree but our users are probably going to go ape if we take all their features (tables, colour, stupid crap they shouldn't use) from them... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:59:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| For Moodle, the 1/3 row switching is very nice. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:59:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| not students, but tutors etc | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:59:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (editor for mobile is stupid IMO. Its going to be built into the mobile os) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:59:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Sam, educate them =) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">9:59:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| Dan P: I agree, different editor (or none) for mobile | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| jfilip - tried that before | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| just try and edit a line on a mobile phone with the standrard iphone/android interfaces | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| its painful, and I imagine they will innovate with their oses | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| any moodle editor used with conflcit with it when they change | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sbourget</span> | |||
| Would implementing Atto put in in the same situation we saw with Moodle 1.x with Htmlarea editor? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| dan - okay but how do you do, I dunno, insert an image together with upload into moodle filesystem? that needs custom buttons etc | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:00:52 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Evernote has a really nice mobile editing interface, you can push a "keyboard" button to remove text input and replace that part of your screen with formatting options. It's really smart and easy to use. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:01:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Stephen, the opposite. HTMLarea was third-pary and it died. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:01:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| If we build atto ourself, it won't die for as long as we use it. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:01:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| jfilip: is that html5 only or in an app?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:01:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| AFAIK, it's in the app. I've never used their Android app before but that's how the editor works in iOS. It's super handy on a phone screen. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| I woukld recommend talking to the accesisblity grou[ | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| is atto liscensed? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| about how costly that will be | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| is that where the cost is? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Jason, Martin posted there this morning. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:02:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| https://moodle.org/plugins/view.php?plugin=editor_atto</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:03:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Editor_2.7 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:03:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| Thanks | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:03:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| RIP mod/assignment | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:04:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Martin Dougiamas has another small minute of silence | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:04:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Tracker issue for the mod_assignment removal? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:05:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-33952 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:05:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| thx | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:05:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Hardin</span> | |||
| On the accessibility group i did see the email breifly this morning. It was 4;30 am when i got up to get to this meeting. I still think it is better to talk to them in the next meeting | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| (lol at gang sign) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| will mod_assignment live on as an add-on at all ?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| There were two questions that went along with Jerome's agenda item which I don't believe were addressed, are those going to come up later? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| Jason Hardin | |||
| the editor has been mentioned in previous meetings but I don't know that the group has been focused on the topic. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| yeah in moodle.org/plugins | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:06:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| isn't it there already? Should be | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| can't add 2.7 plugins yet | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Not yet. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| HQ: change the feed view | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| What dan said | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| roger</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:07:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Is there a wiki page for this latest outcomes work? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| The youtube feed is still looking at Damyon and gang | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| ( / research / etc. ) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| where are you listening to Eric? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ruslan Kabalin</span> | |||
| It is a shame, I do not know (recognise) anyone of those 7 who is sitting at the table, can someone list their names | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Raj is with Damyon | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| jfilip: Not as yet. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| MDL-40230 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40230 - Integrate Outcomes stage 2 into core.V: 3, W: 34, Type: Bug, Assignee: Mark Nielsen, Priority: Blocker, Status: Reopened | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| jfilip: basically we didn't make any decision about hiding/removing themes . I think the best it's to go to each issues. About bootstrap3 it's most likely we won't have it in 2.7. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Thanks, Jerome. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:09:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| mouneyrac: Do you have the link to that document we made, including the BS3 details? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Ruslan Kabalin: testing my short term memory.. Jerome, XY, Rosie, Raj, David Mo, Ankit, Damyon | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| Jerome, XY, Rossie, Raj, DavidMo, | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| See MDL-40177 about Bootstrap 3 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| yes it's in the document I lined and in the issue too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40177 - Update to Bootstrap v3.V: 7, W: 19, Type: Bug, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| I was late | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ruslan Kabalin</span> | |||
| thanks | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:10:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I still have this serious concern about the logging stuff. Look at the diff stat for https://github.com/markn86/moodle/compare/master...MDL-40063_master "Showing 35 changed files with 1,599 additions and 35 deletions. " This is a change that bring no user-visible benefit. How to we justify that huge lines-of-code count? Surely this is a clear sign that the design if flawed. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40063 - Replace add_to_log with an event trigger - mod_quiz.V: 0, W: 4, Type: Task, Assignee: Mark Nelson, Priority: Major, Status: Reopened | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ktkigIsJrxcqPeHWcDdRANA1072JVZZ0azg0INo6v48/edit#heading=h.mhopzjiavfyi | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Petr is off-screen. Lucky. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| that's the bootstrap3 link | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| jfilip, see https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40230 and https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Outcomes_Specification for the outcomes system from Moodlerooms. A document detailing what features we want based on examining the moodlerooms system as well as Totara and Elis will appear in the next few days. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:11:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Logging is eventually about analytics and notifications, real-time | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:12:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Liking the look of this! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:12:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| logging looks nice in the UI, but we have a potential concern with performance as it's a massive cost in the current system already - especially if there are more things logged. (I.e. at the moment a typical student page view logs 1 thing - is that still true?) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:12:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| We store more information about an event, that's true | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Could we change it to chuck it into a local file or something instead, for instance? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| (with custom logging plugin) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:30 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| yeah sure | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| But you can set up not to store some | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| ah OK, single insert sounds good | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Andrew, thanks. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:13:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| the profile of Moodle will change. Some things will be slower, but some things will be faster | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:01 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| MDL-34055 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-34055 - Database function for fast bulk inserts.V: 2, W: 5, Type: Improvement, Assignee: Petr Å koda, Priority: Major, Status: Waiting for peer review | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| ok this sounds good - thanks. Just had concern because it's probably one of the slowest things at present. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| What are the different types? You mentioned "Educational", what are the others? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| well yeah that's why building analytics on top of it is a bad idea | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| (old logs) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I am not sure that I am convinced by the 'it is pluggable so we can do antyhing' argument. editors are pluggable, so we now have a big debate about which editor to implement, and a lot of work to do it. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:14:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| (At OU we don't do anything that reads log table I think - we've disabled all those things.) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:15:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| you can ignore our editor :D | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:15:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| No, you can';t What we really want is one editor that works for everyone. If that is possible. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:15:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| *nods* got it, thanks. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:15:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Plugins with special needs can listen direct to events instead of parsing logs | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:16:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| Another benefit is ability for reports NOT to use log table | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:16:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| Grr I'm always slow on this iPad | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:16:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Great - looks good. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:16:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Petr is surprisingly quiet | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:17:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| thanks for answering all the questions | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:17:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Sorry, you answered my point? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:18:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I don't think so. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:18:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Editor? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:18:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| tim - the editor one or the thousands of lines of code one? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:18:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Which point Tim? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:18:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| SO, to conver the add-to-log calls in the quiz, 35 lines of existing code are repalced by 1600 lines of new code. How is that anything other than the sign of a totally broken API? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Marina Glancy</span> | |||
| Lines of code in logging | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| yes we see it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| yes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| no browser yet</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| I see the browser | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:19:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| ah got it now</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:01 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Perhaps some backend folks want to answer why the API is not broken | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| It is important to have more lines to have reliable, constant information | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| or quiz is broken | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| No trolling please | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| It is important to have reliable, constant information. I am not convince that requires thousands of lines of code. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Sorry about that. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:20:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Moodel Meetings, woudl you like to say who you are? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Martin Dougiamas never liked all the classes nonsense | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| I also have doubts about new logging - I'm not sure what are we really getting here in return for more complexity. What kind of real life issue are we solving? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Most of that is class declarations and unit tests. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Me too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| yes breaking up here too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Wait, Tim are you saying that 35 lines that were previously executed to write a log now goes through 1600 lines or 1600 lines is just the total of the patch? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| yes for us too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| making quite nice bell type noises | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:21:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| here too | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Rajesh: We need to have some framework which can check adde to event | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| lines of code is a stupid metric for anything. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| bad audio here too</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| I'm loosing sound | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">bmbrands</span> | |||
| here to | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| breaking up</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">marxjohnson00</span> | |||
| yep | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| speaker needs a cat5</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Also, lines of source code doesn't translate to interpreted opcode being executed. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:22:53 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Yes, events are more complex than addtolog but add to log was adhoc and not guaranteed to be useful | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| But, to bring it around, yes, profiling logging before / after those changes will be very important. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Dan P, in term of mainteneance, number of lines of code thta have to be written to fire one event is a reasonable metric. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| your painting an extreme picture | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| yeah, less code is always better if possible</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| looking at that code ~50% is unit tests | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:23:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| probably another 25% is comments | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| now, smartly written code can still hit the hot paths</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Petr: please stop complaining about new events, it is part of public API since 2.6, it is nit going away, it works for new reports so far | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martín Langhoff | |||
| so it's hard to tell without reading / profiling</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Dan P, if representing one event is so complex, it requires unit tests to verify the code is correct, I don't think that is a good sign. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| It's not just lines, it's a different API, thus different way of working. Switching from a single function call to an OO model had to create more lines | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:24:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Fred, exactly. I see no evidence that is a good trade-off. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Everything New requires either unit or begat test s regardless of complexity. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Juan: Sorry I couldn't hear very well. This OS X app of moodle mobile available now or with the latest release? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| is there any audio atm? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| adrian, so don't require a new class for every single event. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Dan, v soon | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| dan: yes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:25:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Cool! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:26:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Raj: It would be nice to look at Log and live log reports changes and it gives more information and better filtering. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:26:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| We just need more people getting around this Mobile client and extending it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:26:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Am I the only person who can't hear anything? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:26:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| in the hangout? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:26:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Audio good for me | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| youtube audio is fine</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| I can hear but not see Juan. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| leaving and coming back | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| it worked ok for me | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| audio works fine for me as well | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adrian Greeve</span> | |||
| Any change to logging would generate more test code regardless of the architecture. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:27:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Do you have many stats on the numbers of app downloads of the old versions? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| is messages.moodle.net going to serve anyone who want to use notifications out there?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Raj: If we don't add class then we need to process every event, which needs more processing and sometimes unreliable information (Legacy events which were added previously was good example that one line code is not always good… ) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| adrian, it is a scalability thing. Does every new event requrie new unit tests, O, or does just the core of the system require unit tests, optimisation, etc. O(1). | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Should be the latter. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| An event is just data, not behaviour. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:28:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Juan is there a doc for the nodewebkit/moodle mobile app stuff on moodle.org? Be interesting to see it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| There should be no functionality to test. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| There is a need for data validation | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:24 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| the functionality and test should be of the API, not the individial events ... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:30 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| JAson, yes, but that is not how it currently works. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| but if each event is it's own function, then a unit test will be required... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:29:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| in theory | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Events don't get introduced every day. It should be tested and added with proper thought. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| I asked about download stats for the app | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Exactly. 'IF; | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jleyva@jabber.org</span> | |||
| https://docs.moodle.org/26/en/Running_Moodle_Mobile_in_Desktop | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:32 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Links for integration update:<br /> | |||
[1] https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2662<br /> | |||
[2] cime<br /> | |||
[3] https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Acceptance_testing/Browsers<br /> | |||
[4] $CFG->behat_screenshots_path: http://git.moodle.org/gw?p=moodle.git;a=blob;f=config-dist.php#l659<br /> | |||
[5] https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Backporting<br /> | |||
[6] https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Schedule<br /> | |||
[7] https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-39752<br /> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| danbennett | |||
| Thans Juan! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:30:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Nope | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:31:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| we can hear you dan | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:31:27 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| cibot looks suspiciously like a smurf | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:31:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jleyva@jabber.org</span> | |||
| Aparup messages.moodle.net is only for registered Moodle sites | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:32:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| </span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:32:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| cime | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:33:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jason Fowler</span> | |||
| cime doesn't pay ... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:33:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| :D | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:33:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| cime is great | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:33:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| comme ci, comme ca | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:34:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| I'm addicted to cime | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:34:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| MDLSITE-2662 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:34:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2662 - First public runs of prechecker against various criteria.V: 1, W: 5, Type: Task, Assignee: Eloy Lafuente (stronk7), Priority: Minor, Status: Open | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:34:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Just been asked by Ray Lawrence whether theres any info regarding decisions of server requirements for 2.7 if thats able to be covered today. (Don't shoot the messenger!! :P) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:35:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| it's NOT perfect??? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:35:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| cime watch!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:35:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| We do shifter checks on all issues, but its a different bot | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:35:59 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| phpunit which is easy to install and behat which is impossible to install ;) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ankit Agarwal</span> | |||
| Mdk ftw | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| No. Behat is easy | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| with less compiler being considered to go into core as the in-built thing - any same ideas for shifter?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| No it isn't. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| It is getting easier. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| Ask OU bosses to let you install serious OS | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:36:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| LOL | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| lol | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| good idea, but | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Dan Bennet: https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Moodle_2.7_release_notes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Martin: Yeah I did say to him ... thanks | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| that's current, AFAIK | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| for now ;) haha | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:37:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| I doubt it will change further | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:38:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| ok | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:38:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| Please, report issues and we can work on them | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:38:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| I know I'm going to have to make behat work (for the conditional activity thing) and am dreading it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| then you will love it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Actually, sam, it works for me now. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Except that I get random failures. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ruslan Kabalin</span> | |||
| Dan P, great slides! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Be hat + phantomjs is great (even on windows) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:39:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| tim - Oh, it works now? Are there instructions? Thanks for reassurance, sorry I should be less sarcastic then | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:08 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| yes, nice slides! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Sarcasm is good. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://gist.github.com/danpoltawski/8036489 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Thats David Monllao serving up a paella | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I really ought to copy that to docs. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Frédéric Massart</span> | |||
| LOL | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Great pic lol | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Looks good. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:40:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| Paella!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:41:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| So we want to fix coding style in the line that happened to be edited for another purpose - e.g. https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43040 (I think that's a good idea, why not) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:41:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Also that's exactly what behat code looks like | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:41:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">David Monllaó</span> | |||
| Aparup's home rules | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:41:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| screenshot - i like that | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:42:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Or have no wwwroot | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:43:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Damyon: https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43246#comment-265751 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:43:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Quite a long time == overnight. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:43:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| OK 4 or 6 hours for me. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| on windows? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Yes. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| About the same for me. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Is that a subtle hint about how to bribe the integrators. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| ? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Thanks tim, will look first thing tomorrow | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:44:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| There was a problem found in Linux with ext4, that our tests took something like 10x longer than ext3 …. perhaps someone else can elaborate | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:45:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| (I know it sounds crazy) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:45:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| There are fs options you can add to ext4 mount points to make them run a lot faster. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:45:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| I missed the thing about docblocks/backports - is there a url for this policy? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:45:52 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| AFAIK no-one here found them | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:45:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| sam, yes. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:46:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Scroll back. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:46:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| oh sorry | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:46:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Reject | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:46:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| This is what I use for ext4 on my workstation -- rw,noatime,seclabel,nobarrier,nouser_xattr,errors=remount-ro | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:46:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| thanks Justin, hope that helps someone | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:47:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| i heard about a blackbook Dan</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:47:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| the bit about doc blocks in backports doesn't seem to be mentioned in https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Backporting unless I am missing something | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:47:52 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Hopefully the code freeze will be more relaxed for you this time | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:47:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| But, yeah, when I first switched to ext4 a year or two ago I did notice a dramatic slowdown until I did some digging for options to speed it up. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:48:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Sounds like the new MySQl | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:48:30 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| So, is the code freeze for 2.7 going to be a code freeze or more of a light frost? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:48:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| We discuss in I team and agree, then someone has to update the doc. It will happen soon | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:49:01 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Very cold. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:49:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Soon(TM) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:49:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I missed the key number. Is this 2.7 or 2.6 that will be LTS? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:49:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| No more integrating non-bug fix work the week or two before scheduled release? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:49:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| 2.7 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:50:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| No integrating half done things the week before freeze | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:50:32 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Oh. Woldn't it be better to do risky infrastrucutre chagnes after the LTR? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:50:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| jfilip: we are very firm about it in the integration team for this release | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:50:55 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Damyon: *cheers* | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:51:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| Will the LTS version need backports of all bugs? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:51:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">marxjohnson00</span> | |||
| If it's based on usage/installation, you'll never be able to drop it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:51:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">marxjohnson00</span> | |||
| people will always avoid upgrades unless they have to, look at WinXP | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:51:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Dan Poltawski just wonders about alll.. the bug fixes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Is no there a distinction on which bugs? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| because there are LOADS of bugfixes and some are not very serious and it's been broken forever | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| IMO, the important thing is security and serious bugfixes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| OK | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| some of the nigly bugs people can livewith | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:52:51 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (and often they can cause small changes in behaviour) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| New JIRA label for lts bugs? =) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| was it mentioned how long roughly it'd be LTS'd for? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:25 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| 3 yrs | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| (just echoing Martin for chat | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| So, 2.7, 2.13, 2.19 ? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| thanks sam | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:53:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| -1 to lag | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:54:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| its like prerecording the meeting, and then watching it again and discusisng it | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:54:50 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (in fact that would prob work better) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:54:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Also chat not archived with video | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:54:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Also Google | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:55:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| yeah, the streaming is great, its just the interaction which is a problem | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:55:28 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| it's designed for broadcasting really | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:55:52 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| It's nice that Hangouts on Air have 720p video now. It makes a shared browser window actually readable. =) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| (wait for the lag, michael :P) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| I'd prefer open source and BBB but it was just falling short with larger numbers | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | |||
| Offtopic: Looking to Michael in the darkness... and the reflection on his glasses... do you know F.lux? It works great: http://justgetflux.com</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| +1 to f.lux | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| F.lux is wonderful | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| =) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:36 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| GoToMeeting at all Michael? just a thought | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:53 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| i think that's about cvhanging screen brightness | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:56:54 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Not free tho to be fair | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| Needs to cope with 100 people | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:11 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Michael, we've got someone on our team doing a personal project to research shared communication / meeting systems. If something interesting comes out of it we'll share the findings. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| we could code one ourself! I just built a voice recorder using html5, it's totally reliable*. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| * I am lying | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Maybe a Moodle video conference plugin? lol | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| no f.lux is for your screen brightness ..</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:57:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| we coudl stream to youtube on top of whatever we do, no? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| btw mic unplugged michael? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| oops audio cut off? or just me? oh it's back | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Smoke signals and really powerful telescopes. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| back now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jérôme Mouneyrac</span> | |||
| now yes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| cut off again | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:31 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| back | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:32 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| mic gone soft</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Seems the mic has some kind of crazy limiter lol | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:38 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| lol | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| oops, cut out again.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| v quiet | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:47 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| yeah | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:58:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Over to yuo... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:59:16 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| NSA | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:59:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Matthew Spurrier</span> | |||
| jfilip: i certainly wouldn't recommend using nobarrier, you lose power, you have the potential to lose a lot of data.. also noatime,nodiratime are risky for auditing/security purposes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:59:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Too many torrents | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:59:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Matt, it's just my workstation on a battery backup. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">10:59:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| It's not a server. =) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:00:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Matthew Spurrier</span> | |||
| yah, just pointing it out, just in case ;) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:00:14 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Yeah, you're correct. For something that is "important" or might go down, poorly, those options won't really work. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:00:39 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Nicols</span> | |||
| Nigel McNie (former Catalyst/Mahara) was working on a VC type solution. I'll ping him and find out | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:00:46 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| BBB had a new release | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:00:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| Audio is breaking up for me. Am I alone? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:01:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rossiani Wijaya | |||
| audio seems fine here</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:01:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Do they have an Epic for this in the tracker? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:02:00 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| half of the gradebook proposal comes from David Mudrak… | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:03:30 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| For the Aus cahgnes? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:03:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Would be good to group them with an Epic. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:03:42 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| You can add it to the meeting notes later. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:03:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| OK | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:04:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Rex asked the questions | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:05:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| I've been booted and can't get back in. That's telling for Hangouts. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:05:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| there have been 2 this week.. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:13 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| no major changes expected, just more improvements | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | |||
| bootstrapwood is coming back!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| apart from the two this week, Petr? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I asked earlier if we ahd to convert events in our add-ons when we ugprade to 2.6,and Petr said wait for 2.7. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Once you go bootstrap you never go booback | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Random question: what's up with the namespace stuff in code - are we supposed to use that for all new core code in 2.7? If so is it documented? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:06:35 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| Sam: MDLSITE-2549 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:07:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2549 - Rules for namespacing.V: 0, W: 7, Type: Bug, Assignee: Dan Poltawski, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:07:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| https://moodle.org/local/chatlogs/index.php?conversationid=14661 https://moodle.org/local/chatlogs/index.php?conversationid=14662 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:07:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| No docs in the 2.6 release notes to explain the events changes. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:07:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| Thanks Dan! So, it is not yet defined? OK | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:07:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tomasz Muras</span> | |||
| yeah, I've put GS there | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:03 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=239646 Prateek is on as well</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| MDL-31989</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-31989 - Global Search 2.V: 48, W: 56, Type: New Feature, Assignee: Prateek Sachan, Priority: Major, Status: Open | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| sam marshall: i'm afraid its a bit undefined yep | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:29 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| What is the link to the Moodle Docs? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rex Lorenzo</span> | |||
| For new features, will they still be tested/supported on base? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:34 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| its another one on the integration team list | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:08:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| dan - Let's say I start building the conditional availability changes tomorrow, am I okay to not learn how to use namespaces? Is the question. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:06 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| If its in core still, then yes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:07 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eric Merrill</span> | |||
| Martin Dougiamas: Reload the wiki page, someone added a line | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Rex, that came up earlier: yes. New UI changes should be tested on Base and Clean. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:09 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jenny Gray</span> | |||
| Another random question: what's happening (if anything) with survey 2.0? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:17 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| I found it hard to believe! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | |||
| I really hate people "registering" words like "task" and others without any control. We should not allow first-to-land-wins liberty there. But look for a limited vocabulary. (after thinking about it like 10^6 times)</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:30 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Ther is a link to the tracker issue, but htat is all. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:43 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| More important than name spaces is auto loading, which is great | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:48 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Automatic_class_loading | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:09:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Shall I create a MDLSITE? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| For docs for how to upgrade your add-on? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| damyon - auto loading used to work without namespaces, not sure it still does or not | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Prateek Sachan</span> | |||
| Hi Aparup, Tomasz! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| MDL-39797 - New events infrastructure<br /> | |||
https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Moodle_2.6_release_notes#For_developers:_API_changes | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| Moodle Bot | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-39797 - META: Events 2.V: 2, W: 5, Type: Epic, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Major, Status: Closed | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| just tell petr to stop removing dev_docs_required off his issues with 1 line | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:23 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| That is system spect, not advice for add-on authros. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:26 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| (Dan - thanks for doc) | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Auto loading works with or without | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:53 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| Hi Prateek</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:10:57 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Oooh pretty new homepage | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:12:12 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| i like the colours | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:12:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Prateek Sachan</span> | |||
| Everything is pretty good. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:13:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| MDLSITE-2710 | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:13:18 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Moodle Bot</span> | |||
| https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2710 - The Moodle 2.6 release notes need to make it clear to add-on authors how to upgrade their plugins for the events changes.V: 0, W: 0, Type: Bug, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:13:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Tim Hunt</span> | |||
| Thanks all | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">sam marshall</span> | |||
| thanks everyone sorry for the people who stayed up late... | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">danbennett</span> | |||
| Great stuff! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:33 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">jfilip</span> | |||
| Thanks, all. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:37 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| next dev mtg?</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:40 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Damyon Wiese</span> | |||
| Cya | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:41 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| 3 months | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:44 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Andrew Davis</span> | |||
| night all | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:45 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Rossiani Wijaya | |||
| byeee</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:49 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| roger gdnite!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:53 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Adam Olley</span> | |||
| 2am is a perfectly acceptable sleep time :P | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:14:58 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">bmbrands</span> | |||
| bye all | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Aparup Banerjee | |||
| rave!</span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:02 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Jenny Gray</span> | |||
| sam - was this the music you wanted to end on? | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| Thanks everyone - have a great yesterday | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:04 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Martin Dougiamas</span> | |||
| off to find an air conditioner now | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:05 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ankit Agarwal</span> | |||
| Bye! | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:10 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Michael de Raadt</span> | |||
| I need a burger. | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:15 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Sam Hemelryk</span> | |||
| Perfect timing with the music | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:19 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | |||
| </span> | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:22 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">meetingroom</span> | |||
| Thanks all | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:15:53 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| sam: david fixed the cygwin problem | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:17:20 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Ruslan Kabalin</span> | |||
| Bye, thanks everyone | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:17:21 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| and we need help from newbies identifiying the gaps in the intructions | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:17:56 PM</span> | |||
|- | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">Dan Poltawski</span> | |||
| its practiaclly the same as phpunit in terms of setup, except that unlike phpunit it needs a webserver and browser server | |||
| <span style="white-space:pre">11:20:04 PM</span> | |||
|} | |||
</div> | |||
If you have something you'd like to correct on this page, please [https://docs.moodle.org/dev/index.php?title=Developer_meeting_January_2014&action=edit edit this page] or contact [http://moodle.org/user/profile.php?id=381842 Michael d]. |
Latest revision as of 13:23, 14 July 2021
Developer meetings > January 2014 meeting notes
Time | 13:00 UTC on Tuesday, 21 January 2014 |
Meeting room | Moodle HQ YouTube channel (changed since last meeting) |
Chat | Regular Dev chat |
#moodledev |
The meeting was streamed live on YouTube with chat through the regular Dev chat room and comments on Twitter.
Meeting Video
<mediaplayer>http://youtu.be/o5G0nPzGpZI</mediaplayer> Note: For an optimised view and to see the chat log, change settings to 1024p HD quality.
Meeting Notes
Possible future changes to Conditional Activities (Sam Marshall, OU)
- More flexible, plug-able conditions
- Better access through groupings
- Better interface, lean and mean
- No docs yet, spec and issues coming
Quiz editing changes (Tim Hunt, Colin Chamber, Mahmoud Kassaei, OU)
- Issue, Discussion
- Dependency between questions as a user works through a quiz
- Improving the interface to make it simpler, similar to course page editing, which people are familiar with.
- Possibly a new "combinable" question type that allows something similar to cloze, but with a simpler interface.
- Possibly other OU question types coming to core. It would be good if the community could provide feedback on what's in the Plugins Directory currently.
Moodle 2.7 progress
Prototypes site (Martin Dougiamas)
- prototype.moodle.net
- A site for early development to gather feedback
- Projects currently there include navigation, editor replacement, forum changes, outcomes...
Clean as default theme (Jérôme Mouneyrac)
- Notes
- Resolve open bugs
- Default theme on new install
- Increase configurability, requires ability to compile LESS on-the-fly.
- New navigation is being considered
- Adding an element library
- Allow people to add bootswatches
- It intended that we will move most themes to Plugins Directory (not Standard, Clean or base themes)
- Bootstrap 3 has been considered and won't be adopted yet
Editor replacement (Damyon Wiese)
- Docs
- TinyMCE3 is out of support
- Editor is critical part of Moodle and has huge impact on user experience
- Editor search narrowed down to TinyMCE4, CKEditor and Atto.
- Prototypes were put up and feedback requested.
- Tending towards Atto, with a CKEditor in the Plugins Directory for those who want it.
Old Assignment removal (Damyon Wiese)
- Issue
- The old assignment has been removed and on upgrade instances of the old assignment will be converted to the new.
- If you are using an old assignment type that is not represented in the new assignment you will have to install the old assignment module from the Plugins Directory
Outcomes (Andrew Davis)
- Issue, Docs
- A lot of work done on Outcomes before 2.6 that didn't make it into the release.
- We're reviewing Totara and Elis to see what features are needed overall.
New logging (Rajesh Taneja)
- New events system is in place
- Old logging calls are being converted to events
- More information captured than previous logging
- Performance is an issue, with more events being captured
- Initiatives to optimise DB queries with a single batch insert at the end of a page load.
- Ability to create new observers to reduce the reliance on the log table for real-time analytics
- Logging system is more plugable.
- Potential to push logs to external database
Moodle Mobile update (Juan Leyva)
- New version of app coming soon (fixing issues with new devices with Android 4.4 and old devices with Android 2.1 and 2.3)
- Potential to use the app from the desktop (See https://docs.moodle.org/26/en/Running_Moodle_Mobile_in_Desktop)
- PUSH notifications is top priority
Integration update (Dan Poltawski)
- Pre-checking of issues by CiBot (Continuous integration bot) automated checks on changes before they are submitted to integration (waiting for integration, peer review or with label "cime") (Issue)
- Testing requirements
- PHPUnit or Behat tests required for changes
- Behat improvements
- Misc
- Specific rules for backporting
- Please be aware of the weekly integration schedule
Long term support (Martin Dougiamas)
- 2.7 is going to be a long-term release that will be supported for longer (3 years instead of 18months)
- Backports will be required to backport bug-fixes to the LTS release
A better video conferencing solution for Gen Dev meetings? (Michael de Raadt)
- GoToMeeting (no free)
- Need more suggestions
Questions
Q. What are the plans in 2.7 for Gradebook improvements?
A. Minor bugs being fixed. Three major projects happening, but not going into 2.7. (See MDL-25423)
Q. Will the base theme no longer receive updates or be actively worked on?
A. It will be kept for long term support and fixed for bugs, but may go away after a number of versions.
Q. Anymore changes to the event system? We want to start planning/scoping out analytics/alerts using the new event system in 2.6, but don't want to progress if more changes are expected.
A. Mostly stable now.
Q. Global Search?
A. Code has been written. Waiting for code review for core.
Q. Any plans to actually treat the code freeze deadline as a code freeze for 2.7?
A. That freeze should be colder than last time.
Live Attendees
Adam Olley, Adrian Greeve, Amy Groshek, Andrew Davis, Andrew Nicols, Ankit Agarwal, Anthony Borrow, Aparup Banerjee, Barbara Ramiro, Bas Brands, Damyon Wiese, Dan Bennett, Dan Poltawski, David Monllaó, David Mudrák, Davo Smith, Eloy Lafuente, Eric Merrill, Frédéric Massart, Helen Foster, Jason Fowler, Jason Hardin, Jenny Gray, Juan Leyva, Justin Filip, Jérôme Mouneyrac, Kirsty, Marina Glancy, Mark Johnson, Martin Dougiamas, Martín Langhoff, Mary Cooch, Matthew Spurrier, Michael de Raadt, Mike Churchward, Moodle Bot, Prateek Sachan, Rajesh Taneja, Rex Lorenzo, Rossiani Wijaya, Ruslan Kabalin, S Bourget, Sam Hemelryk, Sam Marshall, Tim Hunt, Tomasz Muras, XY Ng
Meeting chat log
Dan Poltawski | 123 | 9:02:39 PM |
Andrew Davis | ping | 9:02:42 PM |
Dan Poltawski | testing | 9:02:43 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Hi, all. | 9:02:44 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | Good morning | 9:02:51 PM |
Dan Poltawski | commiserations sam | 9:03:03 PM |
Andrew Davis | what is it there sam h? | 9:03:03 PM |
David Mudrák | hello | 9:03:06 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | 2am now | 9:03:09 PM |
Barbara Ramiro | Hi | 9:03:16 PM |
Andrew Davis | awesome. going out raving after the meeting? | 9:03:21 PM |
danbennett | Did someone say rave? | 9:03:29 PM |
sam marshall | techno techno techno techno]# | 9:03:46 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | unce unce unce | 9:03:48 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | If someone is using a screen reader here they're probably getting excited! | 9:04:15 PM |
danbennett | brrrrr wubwubwub do doo doo brrwub | 9:04:28 PM |
Ruslan Kabalin | Hello | 9:04:42 PM |
David Monllaó | Hi | 9:04:50 PM |
sbourget | Hello | 9:04:57 PM |
sam marshall | hey, by end of the meeting you can play the 'it's 4 o'clock in the morning and it's starting to get light' happy hardcore song, I love that one. | 9:04:59 PM |
danbennett | Yes! :D | 9:05:10 PM |
Dan Poltawski | is the link to youtubepasted here? | 9:06:23 PM |
danbennett | 9:06:31 PM | |
danbennett | Now it is | 9:06:38 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | I can get chat on my iPad burr some reason Adium is borked | 9:06:41 PM |
meetingroom | It's live | 9:07:01 PM |
danbennett | You're on! *waves* | 9:07:31 PM |
Mary Cooch | we can see you | 9:07:33 PM |
David Mudrák | Moodle Meetings: you're on my radar | 9:07:42 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Sam just said responded to bug reports | 9:08:55 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Time the lag | 9:08:59 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Now | 9:09:23 PM |
danbennett | now | 9:09:27 PM |
Mary Cooch | oh wow | 9:10:28 PM |
Mary Cooch | "or"/not | 9:10:39 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (do we do introductions/his?) | 9:11:04 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Tim you can be next if you want | 9:11:36 PM |
Tim Hunt | I need to open some browser tabs | 9:11:48 PM |
Jason Fowler | sorry Im late | 9:12:17 PM |
Jason Fowler | pidgin doesn't like my laptop | 9:12:28 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | loving it | 9:12:57 PM |
Dan Poltawski | I don't know where to comment about this.. | 9:13:02 PM |
Dan Poltawski | but we've got a few things which want pluggable versions of the same thigns now | 9:13:15 PM |
Dan Poltawski | like badges | 9:13:19 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | Is there a tracker ticket for these changes? | 9:13:27 PM |
Dan Poltawski | although now i'm thinking, does badges allow activity level awards | 9:13:40 PM |
Tim Hunt | OK, I think I am ready. | 9:14:12 PM |
jfilip | Good [insert appropriate time of day / night here] everyone. | 9:16:11 PM |
Tim Hunt | I thought badges used conditional activities | 9:17:06 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Yes, performance will be tough | 9:17:59 PM |
David Mudrák | Dan P: +1 for trying not to do same things in paralel | 9:18:09 PM |
Jenny Gray | I can imagine some open courseware sites that would love conditional courses with the same sorts of rules too | 9:18:28 PM |
Tim Hunt | Hi from Tim at the OU in Milton Keynes. | 9:18:42 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Hi, Dan from Moodle HQ, Perth Australia | 9:18:43 PM |
David Monllaó | Hi, my name is David | 9:18:54 PM |
Davo Smith | Hi, Davo, Synergy Learning (but based in Sheffield) | 9:18:59 PM |
bmbrands | Hi from the Netherlands! | 9:19:06 PM |
Jenny Gray | Hi, from Jenny at the OU in Milton Keynes | 9:19:06 PM |
Jason Fowler | Hello | 9:19:08 PM |
Tomasz Muras | Hi, Tomek Muras here | 9:19:10 PM |
Anthony Borrow | Hi from Albuquerque | 9:19:10 PM |
Frédéric Massart | Hi from Belgium | 9:19:11 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Hi, Adrian from Moodle HQ, Perth | 9:19:11 PM |
danbennett | Hello! Dan from HowToMoodle (UK) | 9:19:13 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | Hi, Sam Hemelryk from Nelson, New Zealand | 9:19:15 PM |
Jason Fowler | Jason from HQ | 9:19:20 PM |
sam marshall | sam at the Open University in Milton Keynes, UK (as hopefully you noticed from logo on all my slides | 9:19:21 PM |
Adam Olley | Hi, Adam from NetSpot | 9:19:24 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | Hi, Jerome from Moodle HQ, Perth | 9:19:25 PM |
kirsty | Hi from Kirsty at HowToMoodle | 9:19:25 PM |
Amy Groshek | Hi from Amy Groshek, Minnesota, US | 9:19:25 PM |
Barbara Ramiro | Hi from HQ | 9:19:27 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | Hello, Rex from Los Angeles, CA, USA | 9:19:32 PM |
Damyon Wiese | hi from HQ | 9:19:36 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | Hi, Aparup Banerjee, moodle HQ perth | 9:19:40 PM |
Mary Cooch | Hi from Moodle HQ outpost in Preston Lancs | 9:19:41 PM |
David Mudrák | Hi, David Mudrak, Czech | 9:19:42 PM |
sbourget | Hi, Steve from New Hampshire USA | 9:19:46 PM |
Prateek Sachan | Hi, Prateek Sachan here. | 9:19:48 PM |
Helen Foster | hi, Helen in Belgium | 9:20:04 PM |
sam marshall | lol, I liked the 'what the hell are we doing' there | 9:21:11 PM |
danbennett | Haha | 9:21:36 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Hi, everyone. Thanks for coming. | 9:21:37 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Martin Dougiamas waves from home in Perth | 9:21:50 PM |
Jenny Gray | wow, sam my time lag is even longer than yours! | 9:21:51 PM |
Tomasz Muras | so can you define dependency between questions on the question level (so in question bank and not just in the quiz) | 9:23:04 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40987 | 9:24:27 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=231180 | 9:24:33 PM |
meetingroom | error at moodlehq | 9:25:54 PM |
meetingroom | restarting | 9:25:57 PM |
meetingroom | back now | 9:26:22 PM |
Dan Poltawski | you look to be back Moodle Meetings | 9:26:24 PM |
jfilip | I just heard Michael ask everyone to say hi and where they are from. Wow... the lag is going to make asking questions here really difficult. | 9:26:25 PM |
Dan Poltawski | snap | 9:26:27 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://github.com/moodleou/moodle-qtype_combined | 9:27:11 PM |
Dan Poltawski | jfilip: can you think of your questions in advance? | 9:27:25 PM |
Mary Cooch | 9:27:33 PM | |
jfilip | I just reloaded the G+ event page so hopefully it's less lagged now? | 9:28:45 PM |
danbennett | We're looking at tims Github screen if that helps jfilip | 9:29:09 PM |
Tim Hunt | http://www.open.edu/openlearnworks/course/view.php?id=1643 | 9:29:18 PM |
jfilip | Thanks, it looks like you can scroll ahead in the timeline on the YouTube player so I think I'm up much closer to "live". | 9:30:23 PM |
danbennett | If you click the text saying "live" it should forward you right to it as well. (red dot for watching live, grey for behind) | 9:30:51 PM |
jfilip | Yes, it's got the red dot showing "Live" since I scrolled ahead. Perfect. | 9:31:29 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Drag and drop is tough on screen readers | 9:32:02 PM |
Eric Merrill | +1 on the DnD questions. We love them here. | 9:32:29 PM |
Damyon Wiese | There are aria guideline for drag and drop. They are complex though | 9:33:11 PM |
jfilip | We could gather some numbers on usage of qtypes on our customer's sites for contrib types. | 9:33:11 PM |
Dan Poltawski | lesson: with a decent ui.. | 9:33:51 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Using_the_question_engine_from_module | 9:34:06 PM |
Dan Poltawski | can we force the camera on martin? | 9:36:46 PM |
sam marshall | michael, mute microphone please? it keeps switching to you | 9:36:50 PM |
sam marshall | thanks | 9:37:12 PM |
Dan Poltawski | I muted him | 9:37:12 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | we have | 9:37:20 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | we don't see your screen martin | 9:38:06 PM |
Dan Poltawski | I do | 9:38:11 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | i do | 9:38:25 PM |
Andrew Davis | fyi, to stop the screen jumping around you can click on whoever you want it to stay on. click their thumbnail at the bottom of the hangout. | 9:39:45 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | HQ I hope you are remembering to direct the camera for the recording | 9:39:47 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | Whers the beers HQ? | 9:39:56 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | omg no beers | 9:40:25 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | (it's super hot here, I could really use one) | 9:40:29 PM |
Jason Fowler | that's a lot of crazy people at HQ ... you know you have to travel home after this ... unless the tenants upstairs can be bribed ... | 9:40:55 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | TimH just popped on screen for me (again) | 9:41:35 PM |
sam marshall | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43784 | 9:41:37 PM |
meetingroom | https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1eea9oQj1bihpWpsYJGstX_CASLBFF7N51M6DLquixK0/edit?pli=1#slide=id.g2a33bfb2a_097 | 9:41:38 PM |
Damyon Wiese | I have beer. White rabbit. | 9:41:59 PM |
Mike Churchward | Martin -21C here. (opposite of super hot) | 9:42:18 PM |
Dan Poltawski | i've got a flask.. of hot water and mint tea.. | 9:42:24 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | yay automatic less compiler in core! | 9:43:02 PM |
XY Ng | martin: yep we are directing the camera | 9:43:15 PM |
Tim Hunt | Please stop talking about the element library, and get the code in core!!! | 9:43:36 PM |
Tim Hunt | 9:43:38 PM | |
Frédéric Massart | (We need elements first ;)) | 9:43:54 PM |
Tim Hunt | No, release early and release often. | 9:44:05 PM |
Dan Poltawski | MDL-36558 | 9:44:16 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-36558 - Add element library to moodle.V: 11, W: 22, Type: Improvement, Assignee: Sam Hemelryk, Priority: Critical, Status: Development in progress | 9:44:17 PM |
Tim Hunt | Get the basic strucutre, there, then people can add to it. | 9:44:18 PM |
Adam Olley | Not sure if it was mentioned, but does the LESS compiler mean we'll get rid of compiled LESS css files from being tracked at all? | 9:44:48 PM |
bmbrands | jay for bootswatches! | 9:44:58 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | +1 release early n often n om | 9:45:01 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Yes it would, they would go in moodledata | 9:45:24 PM |
Adam Olley | Awesome | 9:45:31 PM |
danbennett | Ooo i likey | 9:45:45 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | 9:45:47 PM | |
Adam Olley | compiled less is a pain when cherry picking :P | 9:46:07 PM |
Frédéric Massart | ^ | 9:46:26 PM |
bmbrands | does it do less compiling when setting the bootswatch? | 9:46:27 PM |
Frédéric Massart | No, this is just a POC | 9:46:37 PM |
Frédéric Massart | But it could (should?) | 9:46:51 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | custom css styles go in moodledata too then i guess? | 9:47:04 PM |
Frédéric Massart | I think they already do | 9:47:26 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | the do indeed | 9:47:40 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | custom css styles should go into the themes | 9:47:41 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | *they | 9:47:49 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | 9:48:05 PM | |
Martín Langhoff | ah! here at last! took some work to get empathy working here | 9:48:19 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | hey hi | 9:48:26 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Welcome. | 9:48:33 PM |
Martín Langhoff | I have been enjoying the show over breakfast | 9:48:38 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | try and look at the agenda and ask your questions 2min in advance | 9:48:39 PM |
Adrian Greeve | POC = Point Of Care? | 9:48:54 PM |
Frédéric Massart | Proof of concept | 9:49:06 PM |
Frédéric Massart | (isn't that right? lol) | 9:49:19 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | y | 9:49:22 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Not Piece Of Cake? | 9:49:28 PM |
Moodle Bot | The cake is a lie adrian. A lie!!!!!! | 9:49:28 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Nano, Pico, Atto | 9:51:32 PM |
Tim Hunt | Are we really, really, sure we want to maintain our own editor? | 9:51:46 PM |
sam marshall | +1 about text editor being important. I'd be interested in how well it works in narrow width, that's a problem with current.. | 9:51:48 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | tim that is the question that is not decided | 9:52:05 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | but i have to say I'm tending that way after lots of thinking | 9:52:44 PM |
Jason Fowler | the greatest benefit of maintaining our own editor is that we never have to worry about upstream changes, abandonment, and the featureset is always what we want. The worst part of that is that we would have to do the work ourselves | 9:54:41 PM |
Jason Fowler | and there is no community around the editor already | 9:54:57 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (I am suspicious about all the maths comments.. I know its important, but I also know the maths editor community are very vocal.. have to balance that to average moodle user who doesn't know what moodle.org is) | 9:54:58 PM |
Frédéric Massart | ^ | 9:55:10 PM |
Amy Groshek | Which of these editors have the options configurable, and how accessible is the config? Currently we are trying to alter the options for the editor in the db with an install script. Giving people options is nice, but then they complain when their theme doesn't apply to the text they've borked in the text editor… | 9:55:19 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | maths is pretty much the same for all editors in that we need to do some custom work for all | 9:55:34 PM |
Jason Fowler | we asked the survey takers to test the maths editor ... | 9:55:47 PM |
Tomasz Muras | there was a license issue with dragmath as well | 9:55:54 PM |
Jason Hardin | The other thing you need to consider with the editor | 9:55:56 PM |
Jason Hardin | is the 3rd party plugins that use it currently | 9:56:02 PM |
jfilip | Dragmath and things like voice / audio recording in the editor are very popular 3rd party plugins for our customers. | 9:56:07 PM |
Jason Hardin | and all of the support you will need to have for them | 9:56:09 PM |
Jason Fowler | amygroshek: they all have cionfigurable options | 9:56:15 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | drag math also works not at all on mobile | 9:56:15 PM |
Jason Hardin | there are several 3rd party math plugins | 9:56:17 PM |
Jason Fowler | atto is the easiest to configure already | 9:56:29 PM |
Jason Fowler | and I think TinyMCE 4 is the next easiest | 9:56:39 PM |
Michael de Raadt | All 3rd party plugins would need to be re-written regardless. | 9:56:41 PM |
Jason Fowler | followed very very closely by CKEditor | 9:56:51 PM |
Jason Hardin | sort of | 9:56:52 PM |
Jason Hardin | some editors will already have plugins for them | 9:56:58 PM |
Jason Hardin | benefit of a standard os editor | 9:57:04 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | CK has lots, that's the main advantage of it | 9:57:11 PM |
Jason Hardin | my plugin should work for Tinymce in all innstances of it | 9:57:18 PM |
Jason Hardin | atto i have to make a plugin specifically to moodle | 9:57:40 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Atto will cost us a lot more | 9:57:43 PM |
Jason Fowler | Jason Hardin: some will have plugins that can be modified to work, yes, but not all of them can be taken and made to work with Moodle without considerable effort | 9:57:50 PM |
sam marshall | We have a few editor plugins at the OU (biggest is our maths one). Also need to turn off standard things that don't work well for us... *shrugs* | 9:58:18 PM |
Amy Groshek | Use Atto. It has less options. = less theme support problems for amy. | 9:58:19 PM |
Frédéric Massart | Atto is close to what would work on mobile (limited set of options, neat interface) | 9:58:21 PM |
sam marshall | I'm not that bothered about updating the plugins if we don't have to do it instantly though, it says on that wiki page it'll keep old tinymce for a few versions | 9:58:41 PM |
jfilip | There were two questions that went along with Jerome's agenda item which I don't believe were addressed, are those going to come up later? | 9:58:47 PM |
sam marshall | Just one thing about simple editor - I 100% agree but our users are probably going to go ape if we take all their features (tables, colour, stupid crap they shouldn't use) from them... | 9:59:23 PM |
Tim Hunt | For Moodle, the 1/3 row switching is very nice. | 9:59:29 PM |
sam marshall | not students, but tutors etc | 9:59:33 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (editor for mobile is stupid IMO. Its going to be built into the mobile os) | 9:59:44 PM |
jfilip | Sam, educate them =) | 9:59:46 PM |
Frédéric Massart | Dan P: I agree, different editor (or none) for mobile | 10:00:03 PM |
sam marshall | jfilip - tried that before | 10:00:08 PM |
Dan Poltawski | just try and edit a line on a mobile phone with the standrard iphone/android interfaces | 10:00:17 PM |
Dan Poltawski | its painful, and I imagine they will innovate with their oses | 10:00:29 PM |
Dan Poltawski | any moodle editor used with conflcit with it when they change | 10:00:47 PM |
sbourget | Would implementing Atto put in in the same situation we saw with Moodle 1.x with Htmlarea editor? | 10:00:47 PM |
sam marshall | dan - okay but how do you do, I dunno, insert an image together with upload into moodle filesystem? that needs custom buttons etc | 10:00:47 PM |
Dan Poltawski | 10:00:52 PM | |
jfilip | Evernote has a really nice mobile editing interface, you can push a "keyboard" button to remove text input and replace that part of your screen with formatting options. It's really smart and easy to use. | 10:01:05 PM |
Tim Hunt | Stephen, the opposite. HTMLarea was third-pary and it died. | 10:01:19 PM |
Tim Hunt | If we build atto ourself, it won't die for as long as we use it. | 10:01:34 PM |
Martín Langhoff | jfilip: is that html5 only or in an app? | 10:01:35 PM |
jfilip | AFAIK, it's in the app. I've never used their Android app before but that's how the editor works in iOS. It's super handy on a phone screen. | 10:02:06 PM |
Jason Hardin | I woukld recommend talking to the accesisblity grou[ | 10:02:36 PM |
Eric Merrill | is atto liscensed? | 10:02:39 PM |
Jason Hardin | about how costly that will be | 10:02:40 PM |
Eric Merrill | is that where the cost is? | 10:02:46 PM |
Tim Hunt | Jason, Martin posted there this morning. | 10:02:48 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | https://moodle.org/plugins/view.php?plugin=editor_atto | 10:03:17 PM |
jfilip | https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Editor_2.7 | 10:03:27 PM |
Eric Merrill | Thanks | 10:03:47 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | RIP mod/assignment | 10:04:18 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Martin Dougiamas has another small minute of silence | 10:04:36 PM |
jfilip | Tracker issue for the mod_assignment removal? | 10:05:08 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-33952 | 10:05:35 PM |
jfilip | thx | 10:05:48 PM |
Jason Hardin | On the accessibility group i did see the email breifly this morning. It was 4;30 am when i got up to get to this meeting. I still think it is better to talk to them in the next meeting | 10:06:14 PM |
sam marshall | (lol at gang sign) | 10:06:15 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | will mod_assignment live on as an add-on at all ? | 10:06:45 PM |
jfilip | There were two questions that went along with Jerome's agenda item which I don't believe were addressed, are those going to come up later? | 10:06:50 PM |
Jason Hardin | the editor has been mentioned in previous meetings but I don't know that the group has been focused on the topic. | 10:06:54 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | yeah in moodle.org/plugins | 10:06:55 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | isn't it there already? Should be | 10:07:05 PM |
Dan Poltawski | can't add 2.7 plugins yet | 10:07:14 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Not yet. | 10:07:24 PM |
Eric Merrill | HQ: change the feed view | 10:07:33 PM |
Damyon Wiese | What dan said | 10:07:36 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | roger | 10:07:45 PM |
jfilip | Is there a wiki page for this latest outcomes work? | 10:09:02 PM |
Eric Merrill | The youtube feed is still looking at Damyon and gang | 10:09:04 PM |
jfilip | ( / research / etc. ) | 10:09:13 PM |
Dan Poltawski | where are you listening to Eric? | 10:09:17 PM |
Ruslan Kabalin | It is a shame, I do not know (recognise) anyone of those 7 who is sitting at the table, can someone list their names | 10:09:23 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Raj is with Damyon | 10:09:23 PM |
Michael de Raadt | jfilip: Not as yet. | 10:09:25 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | MDL-40230 | 10:09:27 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40230 - Integrate Outcomes stage 2 into core.V: 3, W: 34, Type: Bug, Assignee: Mark Nielsen, Priority: Blocker, Status: Reopened | 10:09:28 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | jfilip: basically we didn't make any decision about hiding/removing themes . I think the best it's to go to each issues. About bootstrap3 it's most likely we won't have it in 2.7. | 10:09:29 PM |
jfilip | Thanks, Jerome. | 10:09:59 PM |
Frédéric Massart | mouneyrac: Do you have the link to that document we made, including the BS3 details? | 10:10:07 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Ruslan Kabalin: testing my short term memory.. Jerome, XY, Rosie, Raj, David Mo, Ankit, Damyon | 10:10:23 PM |
Marina Glancy | Jerome, XY, Rossie, Raj, DavidMo, | 10:10:28 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | See MDL-40177 about Bootstrap 3 | 10:10:33 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | yes it's in the document I lined and in the issue too | 10:10:34 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40177 - Update to Bootstrap v3.V: 7, W: 19, Type: Bug, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | 10:10:34 PM |
Marina Glancy | I was late | 10:10:35 PM |
Ruslan Kabalin | thanks | 10:10:44 PM |
Tim Hunt | I still have this serious concern about the logging stuff. Look at the diff stat for https://github.com/markn86/moodle/compare/master...MDL-40063_master "Showing 35 changed files with 1,599 additions and 35 deletions. " This is a change that bring no user-visible benefit. How to we justify that huge lines-of-code count? Surely this is a clear sign that the design if flawed. | 10:11:09 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40063 - Replace add_to_log with an event trigger - mod_quiz.V: 0, W: 4, Type: Task, Assignee: Mark Nelson, Priority: Major, Status: Reopened | 10:11:10 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ktkigIsJrxcqPeHWcDdRANA1072JVZZ0azg0INo6v48/edit#heading=h.mhopzjiavfyi | 10:11:15 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Petr is off-screen. Lucky. | 10:11:22 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | that's the bootstrap3 link | 10:11:27 PM |
Andrew Davis | jfilip, see https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-40230 and https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Outcomes_Specification for the outcomes system from Moodlerooms. A document detailing what features we want based on examining the moodlerooms system as well as Totara and Elis will appear in the next few days. | 10:11:47 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Logging is eventually about analytics and notifications, real-time | 10:12:19 PM |
danbennett | Liking the look of this! | 10:12:23 PM |
sam marshall | logging looks nice in the UI, but we have a potential concern with performance as it's a massive cost in the current system already - especially if there are more things logged. (I.e. at the moment a typical student page view logs 1 thing - is that still true?) | 10:12:33 PM |
Marina Glancy | We store more information about an event, that's true | 10:13:23 PM |
sam marshall | Could we change it to chuck it into a local file or something instead, for instance? | 10:13:25 PM |
sam marshall | (with custom logging plugin) | 10:13:30 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | yeah sure | 10:13:33 PM |
Marina Glancy | But you can set up not to store some | 10:13:36 PM |
sam marshall | ah OK, single insert sounds good | 10:13:38 PM |
jfilip | Andrew, thanks. | 10:13:43 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | the profile of Moodle will change. Some things will be slower, but some things will be faster | 10:14:01 PM |
Dan Poltawski | MDL-34055 | 10:14:02 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-34055 - Database function for fast bulk inserts.V: 2, W: 5, Type: Improvement, Assignee: Petr Å koda, Priority: Major, Status: Waiting for peer review | 10:14:03 PM |
sam marshall | ok this sounds good - thanks. Just had concern because it's probably one of the slowest things at present. | 10:14:20 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | What are the different types? You mentioned "Educational", what are the others? | 10:14:34 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | well yeah that's why building analytics on top of it is a bad idea | 10:14:43 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | (old logs) | 10:14:48 PM |
Tim Hunt | I am not sure that I am convinced by the 'it is pluggable so we can do antyhing' argument. editors are pluggable, so we now have a big debate about which editor to implement, and a lot of work to do it. | 10:14:56 PM |
sam marshall | (At OU we don't do anything that reads log table I think - we've disabled all those things.) | 10:15:12 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | you can ignore our editor :D | 10:15:13 PM |
Tim Hunt | No, you can';t What we really want is one editor that works for everyone. If that is possible. | 10:15:34 PM |
sam marshall | *nods* got it, thanks. | 10:15:48 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Plugins with special needs can listen direct to events instead of parsing logs | 10:16:16 PM |
Marina Glancy | Another benefit is ability for reports NOT to use log table | 10:16:22 PM |
Marina Glancy | Grr I'm always slow on this iPad | 10:16:36 PM |
sam marshall | Great - looks good. | 10:16:41 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Petr is surprisingly quiet | 10:17:36 PM |
sam marshall | thanks for answering all the questions | 10:17:46 PM |
Tim Hunt | Sorry, you answered my point? | 10:18:10 PM |
Tim Hunt | I don't think so. | 10:18:17 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Editor? | 10:18:43 PM |
sam marshall | tim - the editor one or the thousands of lines of code one? | 10:18:51 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Which point Tim? | 10:18:59 PM |
Tim Hunt | SO, to conver the add-to-log calls in the quiz, 35 lines of existing code are repalced by 1600 lines of new code. How is that anything other than the sign of a totally broken API? | 10:19:04 PM |
Marina Glancy | Lines of code in logging | 10:19:10 PM |
sam marshall | yes we see it | 10:19:12 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | yes | 10:19:16 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | no browser yet | 10:19:49 PM |
Dan Poltawski | I see the browser | 10:19:56 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | ah got it now | 10:20:01 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Perhaps some backend folks want to answer why the API is not broken | 10:20:03 PM |
meetingroom | It is important to have more lines to have reliable, constant information | 10:20:04 PM |
meetingroom | or quiz is broken | 10:20:15 PM |
Damyon Wiese | No trolling please | 10:20:47 PM |
Tim Hunt | It is important to have reliable, constant information. I am not convince that requires thousands of lines of code. | 10:20:50 PM |
meetingroom | Sorry about that. | 10:20:56 PM |
Tim Hunt | Moodel Meetings, woudl you like to say who you are? | 10:21:07 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Martin Dougiamas never liked all the classes nonsense | 10:21:22 PM |
Tomasz Muras | I also have doubts about new logging - I'm not sure what are we really getting here in return for more complexity. What kind of real life issue are we solving? | 10:21:36 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Most of that is class declarations and unit tests. | 10:21:37 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Me too | 10:21:45 PM |
sam marshall | yes breaking up here too | 10:21:45 PM |
jfilip | Wait, Tim are you saying that 35 lines that were previously executed to write a log now goes through 1600 lines or 1600 lines is just the total of the patch? | 10:21:48 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | yes for us too | 10:21:49 PM |
sam marshall | making quite nice bell type noises | 10:21:51 PM |
danbennett | here too | 10:22:14 PM |
meetingroom | Rajesh: We need to have some framework which can check adde to event | 10:22:16 PM |
Dan Poltawski | lines of code is a stupid metric for anything. | 10:22:17 PM |
Martín Langhoff | bad audio here too | 10:22:20 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | I'm loosing sound | 10:22:23 PM |
bmbrands | here to | 10:22:24 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | breaking up | 10:22:24 PM |
marxjohnson00 | yep | 10:22:29 PM |
Martín Langhoff | speaker needs a cat5 | 10:22:33 PM |
jfilip | Also, lines of source code doesn't translate to interpreted opcode being executed. | 10:22:53 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Yes, events are more complex than addtolog but add to log was adhoc and not guaranteed to be useful | 10:23:17 PM |
jfilip | But, to bring it around, yes, profiling logging before / after those changes will be very important. | 10:23:20 PM |
Tim Hunt | Dan P, in term of mainteneance, number of lines of code thta have to be written to fire one event is a reasonable metric. | 10:23:23 PM |
Dan Poltawski | your painting an extreme picture | 10:23:37 PM |
Martín Langhoff | yeah, less code is always better if possible | 10:23:43 PM |
Dan Poltawski | looking at that code ~50% is unit tests | 10:23:49 PM |
Dan Poltawski | probably another 25% is comments | 10:24:10 PM |
Martín Langhoff | now, smartly written code can still hit the hot paths | 10:24:18 PM |
meetingroom | Petr: please stop complaining about new events, it is part of public API since 2.6, it is nit going away, it works for new reports so far | 10:24:23 PM |
Martín Langhoff | so it's hard to tell without reading / profiling | 10:24:28 PM |
Tim Hunt | Dan P, if representing one event is so complex, it requires unit tests to verify the code is correct, I don't think that is a good sign. | 10:24:40 PM |
Frédéric Massart | It's not just lines, it's a different API, thus different way of working. Switching from a single function call to an OO model had to create more lines | 10:24:50 PM |
Tim Hunt | Fred, exactly. I see no evidence that is a good trade-off. | 10:25:10 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Everything New requires either unit or begat test s regardless of complexity. | 10:25:33 PM |
danbennett | Juan: Sorry I couldn't hear very well. This OS X app of moodle mobile available now or with the latest release? | 10:25:33 PM |
Dan Poltawski | is there any audio atm? | 10:25:44 PM |
Tim Hunt | adrian, so don't require a new class for every single event. | 10:25:46 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Dan, v soon | 10:25:57 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | dan: yes | 10:25:59 PM |
danbennett | Cool! | 10:26:07 PM |
meetingroom | Raj: It would be nice to look at Log and live log reports changes and it gives more information and better filtering. | 10:26:26 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | We just need more people getting around this Mobile client and extending it | 10:26:38 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Am I the only person who can't hear anything? | 10:26:49 PM |
Dan Poltawski | in the hangout? | 10:26:55 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Audio good for me | 10:27:00 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | youtube audio is fine | 10:27:02 PM |
Michael de Raadt | I can hear but not see Juan. | 10:27:03 PM |
Dan Poltawski | leaving and coming back | 10:27:08 PM |
sam marshall | it worked ok for me | 10:27:22 PM |
Tomasz Muras | audio works fine for me as well | 10:27:29 PM |
Adrian Greeve | Any change to logging would generate more test code regardless of the architecture. | 10:27:43 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Do you have many stats on the numbers of app downloads of the old versions? | 10:28:05 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | is messages.moodle.net going to serve anyone who want to use notifications out there? | 10:28:06 PM |
meetingroom | Raj: If we don't add class then we need to process every event, which needs more processing and sometimes unreliable information (Legacy events which were added previously was good example that one line code is not always good… ) | 10:28:23 PM |
Tim Hunt | adrian, it is a scalability thing. Does every new event requrie new unit tests, O, or does just the core of the system require unit tests, optimisation, etc. O(1). | 10:28:27 PM |
Tim Hunt | Should be the latter. | 10:28:31 PM |
Tim Hunt | An event is just data, not behaviour. | 10:28:57 PM |
danbennett | Juan is there a doc for the nodewebkit/moodle mobile app stuff on moodle.org? Be interesting to see it | 10:29:00 PM |
Tim Hunt | There should be no functionality to test. | 10:29:05 PM |
Frédéric Massart | There is a need for data validation | 10:29:24 PM |
Jason Fowler | the functionality and test should be of the API, not the individial events ... | 10:29:30 PM |
Tim Hunt | JAson, yes, but that is not how it currently works. | 10:29:48 PM |
Jason Fowler | but if each event is it's own function, then a unit test will be required... | 10:29:57 PM |
Jason Fowler | in theory | 10:30:04 PM |
meetingroom | Events don't get introduced every day. It should be tested and added with proper thought. | 10:30:05 PM |
Damyon Wiese | I asked about download stats for the app | 10:30:05 PM |
Tim Hunt | Exactly. 'IF; | 10:30:08 PM |
jleyva@jabber.org | https://docs.moodle.org/26/en/Running_Moodle_Mobile_in_Desktop | 10:30:32 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Links for integration update: [1] https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2662 |
10:30:34 PM |
danbennett | Thans Juan! | 10:30:47 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Nope | 10:31:27 PM |
sam marshall | we can hear you dan | 10:31:27 PM |
sam marshall | cibot looks suspiciously like a smurf | 10:31:49 PM |
jleyva@jabber.org | Aparup messages.moodle.net is only for registered Moodle sites | 10:32:48 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | 10:32:59 PM | |
Tim Hunt | cime | 10:33:12 PM |
Jason Fowler | cime doesn't pay ... | 10:33:33 PM |
Michael de Raadt | :D | 10:33:47 PM |
jfilip | cime is great | 10:33:56 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | comme ci, comme ca | 10:34:09 PM |
David Monllaó | I'm addicted to cime | 10:34:18 PM |
Dan Poltawski | MDLSITE-2662 | 10:34:20 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2662 - First public runs of prechecker against various criteria.V: 1, W: 5, Type: Task, Assignee: Eloy Lafuente (stronk7), Priority: Minor, Status: Open | 10:34:21 PM |
danbennett | Just been asked by Ray Lawrence whether theres any info regarding decisions of server requirements for 2.7 if thats able to be covered today. (Don't shoot the messenger!! :P) | 10:35:14 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | it's NOT perfect??? | 10:35:15 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | cime watch! | 10:35:18 PM |
Damyon Wiese | We do shifter checks on all issues, but its a different bot | 10:35:59 PM |
sam marshall | phpunit which is easy to install and behat which is impossible to install ;) | 10:36:03 PM |
Ankit Agarwal | Mdk ftw | 10:36:35 PM |
Damyon Wiese | No. Behat is easy | 10:36:36 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | with less compiler being considered to go into core as the in-built thing - any same ideas for shifter? | 10:36:43 PM |
Tim Hunt | No it isn't. | 10:36:45 PM |
Tim Hunt | It is getting easier. | 10:36:50 PM |
David Monllaó | Ask OU bosses to let you install serious OS | 10:36:57 PM |
Tim Hunt | LOL | 10:37:03 PM |
Frédéric Massart | lol | 10:37:04 PM |
sam marshall | good idea, but | 10:37:09 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Dan Bennet: https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Moodle_2.7_release_notes | 10:37:11 PM |
danbennett | Martin: Yeah I did say to him ... thanks | 10:37:28 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | that's current, AFAIK | 10:37:38 PM |
danbennett | for now ;) haha | 10:37:44 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | I doubt it will change further | 10:38:02 PM |
danbennett | ok | 10:38:06 PM |
David Monllaó | Please, report issues and we can work on them | 10:38:14 PM |
sam marshall | I know I'm going to have to make behat work (for the conditional activity thing) and am dreading it | 10:39:05 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | then you will love it | 10:39:22 PM |
Tim Hunt | Actually, sam, it works for me now. | 10:39:26 PM |
Tim Hunt | Except that I get random failures. | 10:39:31 PM |
Ruslan Kabalin | Dan P, great slides! | 10:39:51 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Be hat + phantomjs is great (even on windows) | 10:39:55 PM |
sam marshall | tim - Oh, it works now? Are there instructions? Thanks for reassurance, sorry I should be less sarcastic then | 10:40:08 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | yes, nice slides! | 10:40:12 PM |
Tim Hunt | Sarcasm is good. | 10:40:21 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://gist.github.com/danpoltawski/8036489 | 10:40:33 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Thats David Monllao serving up a paella | 10:40:42 PM |
Tim Hunt | I really ought to copy that to docs. | 10:40:44 PM |
Frédéric Massart | LOL | 10:40:50 PM |
danbennett | Great pic lol | 10:40:51 PM |
Tim Hunt | Looks good. | 10:40:56 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | Paella! | 10:41:00 PM |
Tomasz Muras | So we want to fix coding style in the line that happened to be edited for another purpose - e.g. https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43040 (I think that's a good idea, why not) | 10:41:13 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Also that's exactly what behat code looks like | 10:41:21 PM |
David Monllaó | Aparup's home rules | 10:41:26 PM |
Adam Olley | screenshot - i like that | 10:42:46 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Or have no wwwroot | 10:43:10 PM |
Tim Hunt | Damyon: https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-43246#comment-265751 | 10:43:18 PM |
Tim Hunt | Quite a long time == overnight. | 10:43:34 PM |
Tim Hunt | OK 4 or 6 hours for me. | 10:44:07 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | on windows? | 10:44:12 PM |
Tim Hunt | Yes. | 10:44:15 PM |
Michael de Raadt | About the same for me. | 10:44:21 PM |
Tim Hunt | Is that a subtle hint about how to bribe the integrators. | 10:44:33 PM |
Tim Hunt | ? | 10:44:36 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Thanks tim, will look first thing tomorrow | 10:44:45 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | There was a problem found in Linux with ext4, that our tests took something like 10x longer than ext3 …. perhaps someone else can elaborate | 10:45:07 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | (I know it sounds crazy) | 10:45:20 PM |
jfilip | There are fs options you can add to ext4 mount points to make them run a lot faster. | 10:45:43 PM |
sam marshall | I missed the thing about docblocks/backports - is there a url for this policy? | 10:45:52 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | AFAIK no-one here found them | 10:45:58 PM |
Tim Hunt | sam, yes. | 10:46:04 PM |
Tim Hunt | Scroll back. | 10:46:10 PM |
sam marshall | oh sorry | 10:46:15 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Reject | 10:46:47 PM |
jfilip | This is what I use for ext4 on my workstation -- rw,noatime,seclabel,nobarrier,nouser_xattr,errors=remount-ro | 10:46:48 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | thanks Justin, hope that helps someone | 10:47:18 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | i heard about a blackbook Dan | 10:47:33 PM |
sam marshall | the bit about doc blocks in backports doesn't seem to be mentioned in https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Integration_Review#Backporting unless I am missing something | 10:47:52 PM |
Tim Hunt | Hopefully the code freeze will be more relaxed for you this time | 10:47:54 PM |
jfilip | But, yeah, when I first switched to ext4 a year or two ago I did notice a dramatic slowdown until I did some digging for options to speed it up. | 10:48:04 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Sounds like the new MySQl | 10:48:30 PM |
jfilip | So, is the code freeze for 2.7 going to be a code freeze or more of a light frost? | 10:48:56 PM |
Damyon Wiese | We discuss in I team and agree, then someone has to update the doc. It will happen soon | 10:49:01 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Very cold. | 10:49:09 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Soon(TM) | 10:49:21 PM |
Tim Hunt | I missed the key number. Is this 2.7 or 2.6 that will be LTS? | 10:49:43 PM |
jfilip | No more integrating non-bug fix work the week or two before scheduled release? | 10:49:47 PM |
Michael de Raadt | 2.7 | 10:50:19 PM |
Damyon Wiese | No integrating half done things the week before freeze | 10:50:32 PM |
Tim Hunt | Oh. Woldn't it be better to do risky infrastrucutre chagnes after the LTR? | 10:50:40 PM |
Dan Poltawski | jfilip: we are very firm about it in the integration team for this release | 10:50:55 PM |
jfilip | Damyon: *cheers* | 10:51:00 PM |
Eric Merrill | Will the LTS version need backports of all bugs? | 10:51:20 PM |
marxjohnson00 | If it's based on usage/installation, you'll never be able to drop it | 10:51:31 PM |
marxjohnson00 | people will always avoid upgrades unless they have to, look at WinXP | 10:51:49 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Dan Poltawski just wonders about alll.. the bug fixes | 10:52:00 PM |
sam marshall | Is no there a distinction on which bugs? | 10:52:03 PM |
sam marshall | because there are LOADS of bugfixes and some are not very serious and it's been broken forever | 10:52:15 PM |
Dan Poltawski | IMO, the important thing is security and serious bugfixes | 10:52:40 PM |
sam marshall | OK | 10:52:40 PM |
Dan Poltawski | some of the nigly bugs people can livewith | 10:52:51 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (and often they can cause small changes in behaviour) | 10:53:04 PM |
jfilip | New JIRA label for lts bugs? =) | 10:53:05 PM |
Adam Olley | was it mentioned how long roughly it'd be LTS'd for? | 10:53:25 PM |
sam marshall | 3 yrs | 10:53:44 PM |
sam marshall | (just echoing Martin for chat | 10:53:49 PM |
Tim Hunt | So, 2.7, 2.13, 2.19 ? | 10:53:49 PM |
Adam Olley | thanks sam | 10:53:54 PM |
Dan Poltawski | -1 to lag | 10:54:20 PM |
Dan Poltawski | its like prerecording the meeting, and then watching it again and discusisng it | 10:54:50 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (in fact that would prob work better) | 10:54:56 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Also chat not archived with video | 10:54:58 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Also Google | 10:55:06 PM |
Dan Poltawski | yeah, the streaming is great, its just the interaction which is a problem | 10:55:28 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | it's designed for broadcasting really | 10:55:52 PM |
jfilip | It's nice that Hangouts on Air have 720p video now. It makes a shared browser window actually readable. =) | 10:56:07 PM |
Dan Poltawski | (wait for the lag, michael :P) | 10:56:12 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | I'd prefer open source and BBB but it was just falling short with larger numbers | 10:56:15 PM |
Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | Offtopic: Looking to Michael in the darkness... and the reflection on his glasses... do you know F.lux? It works great: http://justgetflux.com | 10:56:15 PM |
jfilip | +1 to f.lux | 10:56:34 PM |
danbennett | F.lux is wonderful | 10:56:35 PM |
jfilip | =) | 10:56:36 PM |
danbennett | GoToMeeting at all Michael? just a thought | 10:56:53 PM |
sam marshall | i think that's about cvhanging screen brightness | 10:56:54 PM |
danbennett | Not free tho to be fair | 10:57:05 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | Needs to cope with 100 people | 10:57:11 PM |
jfilip | Michael, we've got someone on our team doing a personal project to research shared communication / meeting systems. If something interesting comes out of it we'll share the findings. | 10:57:18 PM |
sam marshall | we could code one ourself! I just built a voice recorder using html5, it's totally reliable*. | 10:57:29 PM |
sam marshall | * I am lying | 10:57:34 PM |
danbennett | Maybe a Moodle video conference plugin? lol | 10:57:42 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | no f.lux is for your screen brightness .. | 10:57:44 PM |
Dan Poltawski | we coudl stream to youtube on top of whatever we do, no? | 10:58:02 PM |
Dan Poltawski | btw mic unplugged michael? | 10:58:12 PM |
sam marshall | oops audio cut off? or just me? oh it's back | 10:58:13 PM |
jfilip | Smoke signals and really powerful telescopes. | 10:58:17 PM |
Dan Poltawski | back now | 10:58:23 PM |
Jérôme Mouneyrac | now yes | 10:58:23 PM |
sam marshall | cut off again | 10:58:31 PM |
sam marshall | back | 10:58:32 PM |
sam marshall | 10:58:33 PM | |
Aparup Banerjee | mic gone soft | 10:58:37 PM |
danbennett | Seems the mic has some kind of crazy limiter lol | 10:58:38 PM |
Dan Poltawski | lol | 10:58:42 PM |
sam marshall | oops, cut out again.. | 10:58:47 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | v quiet | 10:58:47 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | yeah | 10:58:48 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Over to yuo... | 10:59:16 PM |
sam marshall | NSA | 10:59:17 PM |
Matthew Spurrier | jfilip: i certainly wouldn't recommend using nobarrier, you lose power, you have the potential to lose a lot of data.. also noatime,nodiratime are risky for auditing/security purposes | 10:59:26 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Too many torrents | 10:59:34 PM |
jfilip | Matt, it's just my workstation on a battery backup. | 10:59:57 PM |
jfilip | It's not a server. =) | 11:00:06 PM |
Matthew Spurrier | yah, just pointing it out, just in case ;) | 11:00:14 PM |
jfilip | Yeah, you're correct. For something that is "important" or might go down, poorly, those options won't really work. | 11:00:39 PM |
Andrew Nicols | Nigel McNie (former Catalyst/Mahara) was working on a VC type solution. I'll ping him and find out | 11:00:46 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | BBB had a new release | 11:00:58 PM |
Michael de Raadt | Audio is breaking up for me. Am I alone? | 11:01:19 PM |
Rossiani Wijaya | audio seems fine here | 11:01:35 PM |
Tim Hunt | Do they have an Epic for this in the tracker? | 11:02:00 PM |
meetingroom | half of the gradebook proposal comes from David Mudrak… | 11:03:30 PM |
Tim Hunt | For the Aus cahgnes? | 11:03:34 PM |
Tim Hunt | Would be good to group them with an Epic. | 11:03:42 PM |
Tim Hunt | You can add it to the meeting notes later. | 11:03:58 PM |
Tim Hunt | OK | 11:04:22 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Rex asked the questions | 11:05:04 PM |
Michael de Raadt | I've been booted and can't get back in. That's telling for Hangouts. | 11:05:23 PM |
Dan Poltawski | there have been 2 this week.. | 11:06:13 PM |
meetingroom | no major changes expected, just more improvements | 11:06:20 PM |
Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | bootstrapwood is coming back! | 11:06:26 PM |
Dan Poltawski | apart from the two this week, Petr? | 11:06:33 PM |
Tim Hunt | I asked earlier if we ahd to convert events in our add-ons when we ugprade to 2.6,and Petr said wait for 2.7. | 11:06:34 PM |
danbennett | Once you go bootstrap you never go booback | 11:06:35 PM |
sam marshall | Random question: what's up with the namespace stuff in code - are we supposed to use that for all new core code in 2.7? If so is it documented? | 11:06:35 PM |
Dan Poltawski | Sam: MDLSITE-2549 | 11:07:02 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2549 - Rules for namespacing.V: 0, W: 7, Type: Bug, Assignee: Dan Poltawski, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | 11:07:03 PM |
Tim Hunt | https://moodle.org/local/chatlogs/index.php?conversationid=14661 https://moodle.org/local/chatlogs/index.php?conversationid=14662 | 11:07:05 PM |
Tim Hunt | No docs in the 2.6 release notes to explain the events changes. | 11:07:20 PM |
sam marshall | Thanks Dan! So, it is not yet defined? OK | 11:07:22 PM |
Tomasz Muras | yeah, I've put GS there | 11:08:03 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=239646 Prateek is on as well | 11:08:06 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | MDL-31989 | 11:08:18 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-31989 - Global Search 2.V: 48, W: 56, Type: New Feature, Assignee: Prateek Sachan, Priority: Major, Status: Open | 11:08:19 PM |
Dan Poltawski | sam marshall: i'm afraid its a bit undefined yep | 11:08:29 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | What is the link to the Moodle Docs? | 11:08:34 PM |
Rex Lorenzo | For new features, will they still be tested/supported on base? | 11:08:34 PM |
Dan Poltawski | its another one on the integration team list | 11:08:58 PM |
sam marshall | dan - Let's say I start building the conditional availability changes tomorrow, am I okay to not learn how to use namespaces? Is the question. | 11:09:06 PM |
Damyon Wiese | If its in core still, then yes | 11:09:07 PM |
Eric Merrill | Martin Dougiamas: Reload the wiki page, someone added a line | 11:09:09 PM |
jfilip | Rex, that came up earlier: yes. New UI changes should be tested on Base and Clean. | 11:09:09 PM |
Jenny Gray | Another random question: what's happening (if anything) with survey 2.0? | 11:09:17 PM |
Tim Hunt | I found it hard to believe! | 11:09:19 PM |
Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | I really hate people "registering" words like "task" and others without any control. We should not allow first-to-land-wins liberty there. But look for a limited vocabulary. (after thinking about it like 10^6 times) | 11:09:30 PM |
Tim Hunt | Ther is a link to the tracker issue, but htat is all. | 11:09:43 PM |
Damyon Wiese | More important than name spaces is auto loading, which is great | 11:09:48 PM |
Dan Poltawski | https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Automatic_class_loading | 11:09:58 PM |
Tim Hunt | Shall I create a MDLSITE? | 11:10:04 PM |
Tim Hunt | For docs for how to upgrade your add-on? | 11:10:12 PM |
sam marshall | damyon - auto loading used to work without namespaces, not sure it still does or not | 11:10:18 PM |
Prateek Sachan | Hi Aparup, Tomasz! | 11:10:21 PM |
jfilip | MDL-39797 - New events infrastructure https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Moodle_2.6_release_notes#For_developers:_API_changes |
11:10:22 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-39797 - META: Events 2.V: 2, W: 5, Type: Epic, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Major, Status: Closed | 11:10:23 PM |
Dan Poltawski | just tell petr to stop removing dev_docs_required off his issues with 1 line | 11:10:23 PM |
Tim Hunt | That is system spect, not advice for add-on authros. | 11:10:26 PM |
sam marshall | (Dan - thanks for doc) | 11:10:49 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Auto loading works with or without | 11:10:53 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | Hi Prateek | 11:10:57 PM |
danbennett | Oooh pretty new homepage | 11:12:12 PM |
sam marshall | i like the colours | 11:12:33 PM |
Prateek Sachan | Everything is pretty good. | 11:13:18 PM |
Tim Hunt | MDLSITE-2710 | 11:13:18 PM |
Moodle Bot | https://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDLSITE-2710 - The Moodle 2.6 release notes need to make it clear to add-on authors how to upgrade their plugins for the events changes.V: 0, W: 0, Type: Bug, Assignee: Unassigned, Priority: Minor, Status: Open | 11:13:19 PM |
Tim Hunt | Thanks all | 11:14:20 PM |
sam marshall | thanks everyone sorry for the people who stayed up late... | 11:14:21 PM |
danbennett | Great stuff! | 11:14:33 PM |
jfilip | Thanks, all. | 11:14:37 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | next dev mtg? | 11:14:40 PM |
Damyon Wiese | Cya | 11:14:41 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | 3 months | 11:14:44 PM |
Andrew Davis | night all | 11:14:45 PM |
Rossiani Wijaya | byeee | 11:14:49 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | roger gdnite! | 11:14:53 PM |
Adam Olley | 2am is a perfectly acceptable sleep time :P | 11:14:58 PM |
bmbrands | bye all | 11:15:02 PM |
Aparup Banerjee | rave! | 11:15:02 PM |
Jenny Gray | sam - was this the music you wanted to end on? | 11:15:04 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | Thanks everyone - have a great yesterday | 11:15:04 PM |
Martin Dougiamas | off to find an air conditioner now | 11:15:05 PM |
Ankit Agarwal | Bye! | 11:15:10 PM |
Michael de Raadt | I need a burger. | 11:15:15 PM |
Sam Hemelryk | Perfect timing with the music | 11:15:19 PM |
Eloy Lafuente (stronk7) | 11:15:22 PM | |
meetingroom | Thanks all | 11:15:53 PM |
Dan Poltawski | sam: david fixed the cygwin problem | 11:17:20 PM |
Ruslan Kabalin | Bye, thanks everyone | 11:17:21 PM |
Dan Poltawski | and we need help from newbies identifiying the gaps in the intructions | 11:17:56 PM |
Dan Poltawski | its practiaclly the same as phpunit in terms of setup, except that unlike phpunit it needs a webserver and browser server | 11:20:04 PM |
If you have something you'd like to correct on this page, please edit this page or contact Michael d.